One of those link round-up posts

Andrew Miller
credit Roger DeWitt

Miller Time

John Sickels has another prospect smackdown, this time it is Andrew Miller vs. Adam Miller. Sickels gives a very slight edge to Adam Miller.

Maybe a SLIGHT edge on intangibles for Adam Miller, Andrew gets a slight edge on tools, Adam gets a slight edge on current polish and performance, even on projection. I rated Adam at Number Six on my pitching prospect list, and Andrew at Number Seven. It’s really, really close but overall I think Adam is just a HAIR better.

What’s up with Leyland?

Apparently Jim Leyland doesn’t want to talk about Mike Maroth not being on the playoff roster. I can’t blame him because that was a long time ago. But it appears to be a sore subject and I’m not sure why.

“That’s kind of a sore subject with me,” a testy Leyland said when asked if the Maroth issue had been resolved this spring. “I don’t think that in my opinion, he was playoff-pitching fit. I guess that’s the best way to say it. I don’t want to get into it, but I’ve read some comments, I know it was disappointing and everything for him, but, particularly with his situation, he really wasn’t a relief pitcher.”

I don’t remember Mike Maroth ever making any comments in the press that criticized or slighted Leyland at all, so I’m really not sure where this is coming from. Maroth has always struck me as a team player, but anyone in that situation would be disappointed. Heck, while I didn’t think he should have been on the roster, I was disappointed for him.

Bad Trades

Joe Posanski writes in his blog about his 10 favorite bad trades. There isn’t a Tiger trade on the list, but the trade that topped his list was a 3 way deal in which the Royals essentially traded Jermaine Dye for current Tiger fan-least-favorite Neifi Perez.

Tiger Stadium proposal

Crains Detroit features what the Old Tiger Stadium Conservancy plans for Tiger Stadium. If includes keeping most of the field intact, relocating the Michigan Sports Hall of Fame, and commercial and residential developments. It sounds great if it all comes to fruition.


21 thoughts on “One of those link round-up posts”

  1. I really think something was said behind the scenes by Maroth. Perhaps not but the reaction is just too strong given what was said in the media.

    Someone in the media brought it up. Who knows how he phrased the question…

    It was the right decision at the time. And to be honest I won’t be shocked if Maroth is off the team after this season.

  2. While I agree, he should not have been on the World Series roster, I think Maroth could be the best pitcher we have next year. I have raved since 2004, about the Cleveland Indians and Maroth.

    It’s probably partly due seeing his one-hitter live against the Bronx Bombers (Shef got the lone hit), but consistently I have seen him be very solid if not very good.

    Granted he doesn’t have Bonderman’s mid-90’s fastball, but most days he has very good command of all of his pitches and his able to pain the corners and get the ball down.

    I thought he would finally avenge his ’03 season and be 10 games over .500 when he was 5-2 with a 2.56 ERA I think.

    Anyways I would not be surprised if he was the best starter the Tigers had this year and put up these numbers – 18-7 with a 3.30 ERA provided he gets the run support.

    Bonderman’s start against the Brewers was one of his best last year in my opinion, showing he can be dominant, but he can wear his emotions on his sleeve and things tend to snowball with him. I think he will continue to cut down on that and follow the trend by cutting down on his won/loss record and ERA, if his changeup keeps improving then he could turn into the Santana or Halladay he wants to be, if not he’s still pretty darn good certain days.

    I have to go with some people on Verlander by saying I think he did throw wayyy too many innings last year, and although he has a good ERA and W/L record, I think he got the benefit of the doubt and our defense helped him out quite a bit. Give him a 15-12 record and slap on a 4.00 ERA and wait til’ ’08 when I think he’ll really bust out.

    Kenny Rogers could not pitch another game in Comerica and he will have been worth more than his 16 mil, but I sure hope he does. He’s fun to watch and I think he can duplicate his results from last year or come pretty close to it. I think he like some older pitchers (Glavine, Clemens) really figure themselves out and are better pitchers, not THROWERS for it. He knows the hitters, he has got great command airbrushes the corners, and like you showed if he speeds up his delivery like he did in the postseason he could be very good.

    Robertson the hard luck pitcher from last year was also a hard luck one in ’05. I’ll admit, I was never impressed by him or Gary Knots, until last year. Very nice guy, and like Bondo and Kenny is a bulldog. I hope that was the real Nate.

    GO TIGS!!!,

  3. Maroth’s start was a bit of smoke and mirrors since his periphials were not that much better than his career rates.

  4. By the way among Maroth, if your in any fantasy leagues, I’d pick Rocco Baldelli, Chris Shelton and Alexis Rios to be super sleepers

  5. Maroth really isn’t that good of a fantasy pitcher even when he is going well. He gives wins and era at times but usually his WHIP is reallly bad and he strikes out very few batters.

    I would have to be in a 15 team league before I consider Maroth.

  6. 3.30 ERA for Maroth? Huh?

    2002- 4.48
    2003 – 5.73
    2004 – 4.31
    2005 – 4.74
    2004 – 4.19

    That’s his ERA by season. How about his OPS allowed?

    2002 – .742
    2003 – .843
    2004 – .777
    2005 – .781
    2006 – .867

    Frankly, his career numbers suggest he’ll have an ERA somewhere around 4.50 and nothing about his other stats (K rates, BB rates, HR rates, etc. suggests he is capable of being much better). He’s a nice back of the rotation starter and somebody capable of giving you 200+ innings, but that’s about it. He is light years behind Bonderman and well behind Verlander and Robertson and Rogers in terms of what you could/should expect in 2007.

  7. I wouldn’t expect a 3.30 ERA from him but he did have a 3.56 before getting injured last year. The last 5.6 innings of relief were pretty bad. If he comes back to the form that he started off with last year I wouldn’t put it past him to be low 4.XX ERA or even high 3.XX.

    It’s really hard to tell what to expect from him this year.

  8. I like Maroth a lot. He kind of got the raw deal because it seemed like he was destined to have his breakout season last year before he got hurt.

    BUt what about this other post? Who is Adam Miller? I have no idea who this cat is, but I know that ANDREW Miller is a big sweeping lefty pitcher, who looks like he could be dominant for years.

  9. I do seem to recall Mike saying he was disappointed not to be playing. Leyland can’t stand “pity parties” from any of his players. We went through all of Mike’s rehabbing starting in Toledo and then when he came back up, he said he wasn’t ready to pitch against the Yankees and that was it. He needs to learn he has to earn his spot. IMO!

  10. The guy had a 2.56 ERA I think before he went 1/3 of an inning against KC and gave up like 6 runs

    Trust me, he will be one of our better starters, you can throw out his old numbers somewhat.

    I’m not saying he will strike out a ton of guys, but I think he will evolve and he showed it to me in April and May of last year.

  11. It seemed one of the most common criticisms of the Tigers last year is that they were a mediocre team that was somehow “over-performing”. I don’t think that was true of the team as a whole, but maybe for some of its pitching, specifically Maroth and Robertson. They were known quantities who suddenly took off and way exceeded expectations. I’m just saying I’ll take a wait and see attitude on them and hope for the best. I like them both tremendously as players and I’m really hoping last season was a breakthrough for them and not a fluke. Besides, anyone who’s not rooting for Maroth this year, given his history, has a lemon where his heart should be.

  12. I think Leyland is referencing the criticism of fans and the media, rather than anything Mike did. Every paper in Detroit complained about the playoff roster decision (my favorite bit was when a reporter suggested batting Maroth in the lineup instead of Perez).

  13. We all want Maroth to succeed, but David, I think you’re overstating him. He’ll have better numbers than his first couple years because he’s a contact pitcher with a good defense behind him, and because the Tigers have better relief pitching to strand his runners. But I just don’t see how I could rank him above any of the other four on the staff. Best case, he’s a low 4 ERA pitcher.

  14. I think Robertson did find a new performance level. But that is because he actually found new levels of performance in certain key indicators.

    Maroth on the other hand….

    His ERA was the best on the staff but that is not the only thing to judge a pitcher by.

    His WHIP was 1.364 which is not that much lower than his career WHIP of 1.40. His K/9ip was 4.15 and his career was 4.4. His K/BB was 1.4667 which is actually worse than his career at 1.849.

    His h/ip did improve though with 1.049 versus his career of 1.135.

    With these stats it seems to point to luck more than a true gain in skills. To do these numbers I did take out his performance in the KC game and after.

    Part of it may be the improved defense as well. But it doesn’t seem like his stats outside of ERA improved enough to explain the gain. I think he is a mid 4’s era type guy. Not terrible but not great. Good 5th starter.

  15. I think Kenny really taught him something, and although prior stats are important they don’t have any bearing on the present season. Look at a guy like Carpenter or Rodney or Lackey the list could go on and on, alot pitchers who stick in the league seem to really figure out how to pitch to oposing batters, and really grow as pitchers.

    And if you want to keep harping on his prior stats check out his carrer line against the TRIBE

    8-3 W/L 2.71 ERA .237 BAA

    And when he does well this season you all know who said it here!


  16. The difference between Maroth and those other pitchers is that they showed they figured it out through other metrics. Metrics that are future performance indicators. Like K/BB, K/9ip, h/ip, and WHIP.

    Yet Maroth had close to the same stats even in his hot start other than his ERA. Why should we believe that a marked gain was made when his future indicators show a different story?

    Sorry but what does a small sample size against the Tribe tell me? Oh it tells me what that pitcher has done in the past versus one of 30 teams? Great….

    Perhaps he will have a great season. But I am skeptical just like I am skeptical that he will be on the Tigers at this point next season.

  17. Well it tells you that hes owned the Indians, and considering they are one of the scariest teams that should be a good thing…

  18. Its a good thing. But it doesn’t tell me anything about Maroth overall. He isn’t going to be facing the Indians 35 times a season.

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