The Detroit Tiger Weblog



« | »

Game 2013.67: Tigers at Twins

Detroit Tigers: 37-29, 1st Place (4.5 ahead of Cleveland). 

Here are a few of the things that we know, statistically, about the Detroit Tiger offense at this point in the season:

Let’s set aside the more specific late and close statistics for now, and just look at the overall late inning statistics. In innings 7-9 the Tiger hitters come out 14th best in OPS out of 15 teams (luckily that 15th team is Cleveland):

So once it hits the 7th inning, the Detroit Tigers become the American League team least likely to score. It has been said that the bullpen problems put pressure on the hitters. Doesn’t it seem likely that knowing that there are no more runs coming from the offense also puts pressure on the bullpen?

Here are the individual numbers, ranked by OPS, for inning 7-9 hitting:

  1. .286/.929 Tuiasosopo
  2. .254/.853 Cabrera
  3. .266/.791 Fielder
  4. .274/.714 Infante
  5. .245/.656 Dirks
  6. .254/.649 Peralta
  7. .235/.611 Martinez
  8. .184/.525 Avila
  9. .195/.511 Jackson
  10. .222/.489 Pena
  11. .200/.471 Garcia
  12. .138/.458 Kelly
  13. .113/.376 Hunter
  14. .067/.243 Santiago

Quick reaction: let’s have more Tuiasosopo!

You’ll notice above that On Base is the only category in which the Tigers are decent (8th). In other words, somebody is getting a lot of late inning walks. Those somebodies are Cabrera (14) and Fielder (12), which is why they are so high up on the OPS ranking. In other words, once it gets late in games, teams are pretty much done pitching to those two.

Apparently they have plenty bases open by the time Cabrera comes up, with Hunter struggling with a .214 late inning on base percentage. Torii was the biggest surprise for me when I pulled these numbers up. Here are his splits:

So there it is, over the course of a game Torii Hunter goes from a .400 hitter to an average hitter to a pitcher trying to bat. Is it fatigue? He seems to have lost a step in the outfield. Maybe Leyland knows what he is doing giving Hunter frequent days off?

*****

Today Doug Fister takes on the Pajama Man, P.J. Walters. These two faced off on May 25, where Walters bested Fister in a 3-2 victory, sprinkling 8 hits over 6 innings. Pena had a big game against Walters (3-for-4), and Peralta hit a solo shot. Walters has pitched well since then, and has a 2.49 ERA for the season. As in his first outing against Detroit, guys do get on base against him–his WHIP is 1.46–but they don’t seem to score. Fister has his fingers crossed–the Tigers have put up a total of 4 runs in his last 4 starts.

*****

Today’s Player of the Pre-game:  Let’s go with Dad here. Happy Father’s Day everybody!

Today’s Where’s Pena? Lineup:

  1. Jackson, CF
  2. Hunter, RF
  3. Cabrera, 3B
  4. Fielder, DH
  5. Martinez, 1B
  6. Peralta, SS
  7. Dirks, LF
  8. Infante, 2B
  9. Avila, C

No, that is not a mistake, Avila gets the start again, despite Pena having the 3-for-4 day against Walters May 25. I guess Avila is “due.”

Posted by on June 16, 2013.

Categories: 2013 Season, Game Post

82 Responses

  1. Great info Coleman, some eye opening (and mindboggling) stats re: DET’s late inning offensive woes. Whatever weaknesses this team has (and clearly there are some), we can all take solace in fact that they’re in the AL Central – “so I got that goin’ for me…which is nice” –Carl Spackler

    by StorminNorman$ on Jun 16, 2013 at 12:22 pm

  2. Strange about Pena not starting, Last series, there was talk of a few days off for Avila. And now he’s started every game against the Twins. Not getting it, even beyond the Pena 3 for 4 off Walters thing.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 12:46 pm

  3. One gets the impression from the stats above (great job, Coleman, details I hadn’t investigated) that after 2-3 at bats, the hitters feel like they’ve done their part and call it a day. This is often reinforced by what you see at the plate. Although maybe that’s reading what I already know into what I see when the outcome is unfavorable. Hard tellin’.

    It’s hard to believe Hunter (or anyone) could be physically fatigued at the plate from mostly standing around in the outfield. Maybe it’s mental fatigue.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 1:01 pm

  4. Going by WPCT, the Tigers project to 91-71. Going by games over .500, it’s 85-77. Split the difference, it’s 2012. Isn’t this team much, much, much better than the 2012 version?

    I don’t think 85-77 wins the Central, weak as it may be.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 1:07 pm

  5. http://www.freep.com/article/2.....Pittsburgh

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 1:13 pm

  6. Trevor Plouffe is 6 for 17 with an OPS of 1.300, 2 2B, 2 HR, 4 RBI, 4 BB, against the Tigers this season.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 1:19 pm

  7. It’s only strange if you are looking at it calmly and rationally. The criticism has been building on Leyland for a while now and he doesn’t handle pressure very well. He’ll go with his gut more, so contradicting himself shouldn’t be a surprise. If they lose today, watch his head spin.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 1:31 pm

  8. Not exactly on the same level as being remembered for back-to-back no-hitters, but better than being remembered for all those strikeouts.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 1:33 pm

  9. An interesting thought. I think a claim could be made that they have overall better players this year, but as a team maybe not. I think there may be something at work here that can’t be defined by purely statistical analysis. They seem to be lacking the mysterious “It”. Drive, desire, will to win, etc., are all nebulous but nevertheless real components necessary for success. You can’t just depend on talent. Encouraging those areas are where the manager comes in IMO. Casey Stengel, in the heyday of the Yankees, for example, was a master at squeezing that little bit of extra out of his players.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 1:48 pm

  10. For PHToy:

    The Tigers bullpen has allowed the fewest inherited runners to score in the AL at 22. In terms of percentage they are in the middle at 29% (league avg. = 30%). Coke and Downs are the current champions of the IRS with 10 runs between them (nearly 50% of the team total) and each at a 33% rate.

    The Tigers bullpen problem is allowing their own runners to score. They’ve been charged with 32.9% of the runs (and 40.9% of the HR) in 31.4% of the innings.

    Check this out: The Tigers have pitched relievers on consecutive days the fewest times of any team in the AL at 25. They are at the top in pitches per relief appearance at 20. Hmmm.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 1:50 pm

  11. Brandon needs everything he can get. I think popping his separated shoulder back into its socket (while with the A’s) will end up topping everything in Legend Of Inge lore, though.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 1:52 pm

  12. At least Avila is batting #9 now. That’s a step in the right direction. Wouldn’t mind seeing Peralta moved up to #5 and Martinez coming down a peg or two. 32 RBI, woo-hoo! Ramon Santiago would have 32 RBI batting behind Cabrera and Fielder.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 1:57 pm

  13. For me, with the addition of an extra playoff team now, winning the division, especially so if it is a weak one, isn’t as important as it used to be. They need to be good in relation to the best teams in the league to have real legitimacy, not just the division.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:01 pm

  14. I agree, and in fact wouldn’t mind if Martinez actually sat for a few games (or at least occasionally) in favor of You-Know-Whui. Avila should be batting 26th. Anyway, don’t hold your breath.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:03 pm

  15. That happened when he was with the Tigers too. Maybe he has the record for that also.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:04 pm

  16. They don’t act like an unhappy or tired or fractious team. Sometimes things just don’t go well no matter how you try.

    The Tigers get tripped up by some little things sometimes. These times stand out in memory and make us think they are “lacking in fundamentals,” etc.. But I’ve seen it work both ways. Chance and luck play a big part in baseball, too. Never easy to tell which sort of luck your team is “due” for.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:06 pm

  17. “They are at the top in pitches per relief appearance at 20″.

    I wonder if this has always been so in the Leyland era. One of my beefs with his bullpen management over the years has been leaving guys in too long (especially the “role” guys). Now 20 pitches doesn’t seem like a lot, but when they are generally in only for an inning… On the other hand, you could have a long man come in and throw 50 pitches, so that would throw the average off.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:12 pm

  18. And there goes Torii with some of that good inning 1-3 stuff!

    by Coleman on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:17 pm

  19. Congratulations on #300!

    by Coleman on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:22 pm

  20. theres only one reason Avila is catching today…Mumbles knows everyone is (expletive) about it and this is Mumbles I will show you who the (Expletive) boss is

    by judpma on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:30 pm

  21. It looks like VMart has better defensive abilities at fist than Prince ….. how long would his legs hold out if he played on a regular basis?

    by TIGERS RULE on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:31 pm

  22. Can you believe that 2B>

    by sky on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:33 pm

  23. and Avila comes thru..It only took Mumbles 7 games to get that production from him…

    by judpma on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:34 pm

  24. Avila is such a power hitter. I can’t believe Jimbo has him batting 9th!

    by sky on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:35 pm

  25. We’ll never know.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:53 pm

  26. At one point early in the season, we had the best production from the #9 slot, so maybe finally realized that that was were Avila needed to be to get him going.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 2:55 pm

  27. Lots of groundouts today.

    Pointless statistical comparison: Who would you rather have as your regular catcher?

    Since May 1
    John Buck (he of the fast start who lead the NL in HR early on): .200/.278/.283/.561 (2 HR ,10 RBI in 129 PA)
    Alex Avila (he of the slow start and slow middle): .146/.271/.247/.518 (2 HR, 10 RBI in 105 PA) Note the higher OBA than SLG – how often does that happen.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 3:27 pm

  28. Strike em out/ throw em out (at 3rd!) with Avila at bat – how dumb can you be!

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 3:43 pm

  29. Leyland was trying to avoid the typical Avila ground-ball to 2nd double play. This was at least a more entertaining double play, like the Avila bunt-into-DP variety was.

    by Coleman on Jun 16, 2013 at 3:45 pm

  30. That’s one way to break up a no-hitter. Let’s hope that hit is an “Inge.”

    by Coleman on Jun 16, 2013 at 3:47 pm

  31. total Leyland 101 start yyour runners with the guy who leads your team in K’s…his rational will be “you guys are (Expletive) cause I never try anything….well (expletive) take that!!!

    by judpma on Jun 16, 2013 at 3:48 pm

  32. looks like the starting pitchers are starting a new QS streak..Fister excellent!

    by judpma on Jun 16, 2013 at 3:49 pm

  33. I stand corrected, +1 Leyland.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 3:50 pm

  34. Happy Father’s Day DTW Dads.

    We gotta win series. On our way, hopefully the pen can hold a 3 run lead. Though Fister may have 9 in him today.

    by Kevin in Dallas on Jun 16, 2013 at 3:52 pm

  35. We are in the Tigers Dead Zone with only a 3-run lead. That puts us close (no pun intended) to Expletive Deleted Valverde territory.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 3:54 pm

  36. The walk to Florimon provides a good example of a starter being removed a batter too late. Leyland has this thing about letting or making pitchers finish innings. Following the double by Dozier, it was an excellent time for a Coke or Downs to come in against Florimon. I’d call this an example of bullpen mismanagement.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:21 pm

  37. I nominate Dozier to the Luke Scott club of Tiger wreckers

    by judpma on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:23 pm

  38. Followed by the obligatory “8th Inning Guy” instead of a LOOGY to pitch to Thomas – Coke or Smyly in this instance because Downs would be worn out (2 days in a row is a no-no) from yesterday’s action.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:27 pm

  39. Fister has been screwed by the bullpen too many times. I am turning off the game now. I will check the score in 30-45 minutes. I hate to admit I fully expect another late game loss. Will anything be learned ever by upper management? Will they ever decide that a relief pitcher is even more important than .for, example, Jhonny P? I really think so.any comments? Can’t the team give up some serious assets to find someone reliable?

    by sky on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:29 pm

  40. Alex, no one deserves that.hope you’re okay

    by sky on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:31 pm

  41. A ValVerde saver by Hunter…great at bat

    by judpma on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:42 pm

  42. Good job Torii! (maybe that red print in the game post got to him).

    by Coleman on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:42 pm

  43. That’s a huge run.

    by Coleman on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:43 pm

  44. Miggy chased. Not good.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:47 pm

  45. I was thinking the same thing. You made him mad. Good.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:48 pm

  46. TV off I Am outta here..not enough of a lead for me…..and by the way how can Pena not make it allthe way fromfirst to second on a wild pitch!!!..could be a huge run

    by judpma on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:48 pm

  47. I was only briefly interested during the offseason in the Tigers going outside to find a closer. No interest in it now or for the duration of the season.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:55 pm

  48. Is that an audition for the closer job by Benoit?

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:55 pm

  49. This wasn’t a WP Pena could have advanced on under the circumstances. Watch it again.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:56 pm

  50. He failed it. No drama whatsoever. Lousy, flat, pedestrian performance. Boo! Hiss!

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:57 pm

  51. Every Twin seems to join this club at one time or another during the course of a season.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:58 pm

  52. I agree. The bullpen is OK if it is managed properly. And with mismanagement, adding another arm won’t make any difference.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 4:59 pm

  53. Yeah, probably just a one-off. Valverde will be back.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 5:01 pm

  54. Benoit pitched the 9th in a save situation?! I better get to my shelter.

    by Kevin in Dallas on Jun 16, 2013 at 5:01 pm

  55. That two days in a row is a no-no is so stupid. It has proven to… what? Keep the bullpen “fresh”? Is Leyland paralyzed by the fear of possibly going 18 innings and running out of relievers? I thought that’s why Kelly was around.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 5:01 pm

  56. You only have to look at the starting rotation to know that the Tigers have used long relief far less than the average, so the average pitches per relief appearance wouldn’t be driven up that much by this factor.

    Yes, I think Leyland does leave the relievers in too long on many occasions, and the relievers themselves are inefficient, very often (though I can’t statistically verify this at the moment) falling behind in the count, being fouled off endlessly and unable to put away batters, etc.. Besides giving up hits and runs, which also costs pitches. To their credit, high K rate contributes as well, I’m sure.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 5:08 pm

  57. Nice to see Jackson back and seemingly all the way back. Different feel with him in the lineup. Not a myth at all, though I had to smile at Rod Allen saying that the team gets off the bus in a different way when Jackson is in the lineup. (Does he exit leadoff?)

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 5:10 pm

  58. It looked to me like it hit him on the inside forearm just below the wrist, not on the bones. That’s a painful thing, probably a really bad bruise that will force him to miss some time, but better than it could have turned out. Just my take, not sure about this.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 5:13 pm

  59. I didn’t see the lead/break by Infante. Not sure if that was a difference maker. Of course, the hope was for contact, and Avila is the last guy you want for contact. This wasn’t the time for a “get him going” hit and run, for certain.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 5:16 pm

  60. I think Prince is pretty sharp at 1B, but V-Mart has also been good there every time out, I must say. I need to back off the claim that he’s good for nothing if he doesn’t hit. He was *really* good at 1B today.

    The Tigers have at least 5 guys who can play a position where no backup is necessary. Plus Jordan Lennerton at Toledo. That’s funny. Then again, I suppose most teams have a good 4 guys who can play 1B.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 16, 2013 at 5:21 pm

  61. amazing concept; use you best reliever in the 9th inning in a close (or semi-close) game.

    by William on Jun 16, 2013 at 5:51 pm

  62. The cameraderie is there. But the 7-9 fail is not a little thing, it has been going on all season. Something is amiss there and it isn’t necessarily lack in fundamentals either. Focus? Anyway weird and I hope it goes away.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 5:56 pm

  63. Congrats to Avila for hutting for the cycle..double..single..HBP….hey were not talking Mike Trout here!

    by jud on Jun 16, 2013 at 6:21 pm

  64. Tui and Lennerton might make a good platoon at DH, with Lennerton a fill-in at 1B and Tui also able to play 1B, as well as 3B and LF. Maybe next year.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 8:57 pm

  65. I got a kick out of Leyland saying post-game that he went with Benoit in the ninth because he liked his repertoire of pitches better than Valverde’s in that particular setting.

    No (expletive deleted) Sherlock!

    by Vince in MN on Jun 16, 2013 at 9:02 pm

  66. SL – Thanks for the excellent analysis. The IRS data is surprising!

    Maybe the blow-pen is not really all that bad and most of late-inning losses are due to the lack of late-inning offense – as evidenced by the lousy record in extra inning games.

    by PHToy in HK on Jun 16, 2013 at 10:09 pm

  67. We shall see if the home field advantage continues against 3 quality teams: BAL, BOS & LAA = 10 game home stand

    by StorminNorman$ on Jun 17, 2013 at 11:42 am

  68. BAL & BOS will be the real test. Although LAA is a mess, you can’t count them out either. A poor showing in the first 7 games could set us up for a real catastrophe (Cat’s afta me?). This is a very important home stand and we’ll see what JL and these Tigers are made of.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 17, 2013 at 3:20 pm

  69. Yes, I found the IRS a bit surprising myself. Earlier in the season, it wasn’t looking so good. I can’t give exact figures, but I’m quite sure that most of the inherited runs allowed to score have been inherited from other relievers. This is because Tigers starters rarely (as compared to average) come out of games mid-inning.

    The blow-pen is not as bad as we think, and the late-inning offense is a factor, but it’s clear enough that the Tigers haven’t had the kind of bullpen their starters deserve. Starting pitching has carried the Tigers more than anything else so far. Imagine how they could start rolling if either the bullpen or the hitting became that consistent.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 17, 2013 at 5:21 pm

  70. Aren’t we stuck with Martinez through 2014, though?

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 17, 2013 at 5:22 pm

  71. LAA is one hot mess, but they’re 3-0 vs DET this year.

    Despite DET having favorable starting pitching matchups against BAL & BOS, i’d be happy with a 5-5 home stand…hopefully they exceed my expectations.

    by StorminNorman$ on Jun 17, 2013 at 5:23 pm

  72. Too funny. Repertoire of pitches. I wonder what constituted “that particular setting.” A situation where something other than a fastball might be effective?

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 17, 2013 at 5:26 pm

  73. I think the Avila cycle is strikeout, walk, groundout to 2B.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 17, 2013 at 5:27 pm

  74. http://www.freep.com/article/2.....1050/rss15

    Sanchez and Avila to 15-day DL, Alvarez, Garcia, Holaday called up. Someone going down, presumably… Reed?

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 17, 2013 at 5:33 pm

  75. Although… two position players coming up. Wouldn’t that mean…? But how? Who?

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 17, 2013 at 5:37 pm

  76. Tonight’s starter for the Orioles, Arrieta, was a guy I was a bit interested in over the offseason as part of some Peralta for Hardy deal. Interested to see him pitch. Of course, I hope he stinks against the Tigers.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 17, 2013 at 5:42 pm

  77. For the time being they can get by with an 11-man staff because the starters all go so deep and (considering Leyland leaves the relievers in too long – ;) ) there isn’t a need for 7 relievers provided JL isn’t afraid to pitch somebody two days in a row once in a while. The other possibility is that they DFA Tui who isn’t playing that much anyway – just kidding. I would actually be very surprised if they went with an 11-man staff for long though, since this I think this would make JL very very nervous.

    I am eager to see how we do with Pena as the regular catcher. I hope Avila isn’t seriously injured, but maybe the HBP will turn out to be a “silver lining” event. Though I don’t expect much punch from Holaday, maybe Avila will get straightened out during his layoff/rehab. You have to hope something good comes of this.

    Sanchez going back on the DL is the troubling news. Hopefully Alvarez fills in adequately while he is out. And having a LH in the rotation isn’t a bad thing.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 17, 2013 at 6:07 pm

  78. With the 7-end offense we don’t need to worry about going 18 innings and running out of relievers.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 17, 2013 at 6:13 pm

  79. Yeah you’re right. I thought this was the last year. Wishful thinking on my part I guess. So both V-Mart and Hunter will be plugging up the roster next year, making it difficult to see how we can easily insert some young, fresh (and cheap) blood into the roster. Well, that’s a ways off. Better not to think about that until after the World Series (hopefully).

    by Vince in MN on Jun 17, 2013 at 6:21 pm

  80. [...] 2013.68: Orioles at TigersGame 2013.67: Tigers at TwinsGame 2013.66: Tigers at TwinsGame 2013.65: Tigers at TwinsGame 2013.64: Tigers at RoyalsGame [...]

    by Game 2013.68: Orioles at Tigers on Jun 17, 2013 at 6:26 pm

  81. And unlike the Tigers, the Red Sox and Orioles are two teams that actually “slug it”. Hopefully 4-3 vs. those two and then payback time for the Angels.

    by Vince in MN on Jun 17, 2013 at 6:33 pm

  82. Sanchez troubling, yes. A run of 67 games with only one “soreness” missed start before a starter hits the DL is pretty remarkable, though. Lucky stars.

    I think a rehab assignment at Toledo of, oh, 30 to 60 days, maybe more, might be in order for Avila when he come’s off the DL. Might “get him going.” Regular at bats, that sort of thing, Plus, you can’t hurry a bruised wrist. Might have to shut him down for the season. Did wonders for V-Mart.

    I’m interested in seeing how Pena handles being the de facto starter for a while. With you on the hope something good comes of this, not serious on wishing Avila to be completely gone.

    by Smoking Loon on Jun 17, 2013 at 6:43 pm

« | »




Recent Posts


Pages



About The Detroit Tiger Weblog

About the Site Detroit Tigers Weblog was launched in July, 2001. At the time it was the only Tigers blog and it resided as a blogspot page. There were multiple authors and it mostly consisted of links to the rare times the Tigers were mentioned in the national media. We only had a few dozen […]more →

Switch to our desktop site