Game 122: Orioles at Tigers

by billfer on August 15, 2008 · 50 comments

in 2008 Season,Game Post

PREGAME: The Tigers look to extend their 1 game winning streak to more than 1 game. They’ll face Chris Waters who has a total of 12 big league innings under his belt. In his first start he went on the road in LA and pitched 8 innings of 1 hit, shut out ball. In his second start the Rangers got to him for 6 runs in 4 innings.

Nate Robertson is coming off of one of his better starts of the year. Granted, it was against the A’s, but he fanned 5 and allowed just 5 hits and a walk in 7.1 innings. The last time he faced the Orioles he was spotted a 6 run first inning lead which he obliterated in the third inning.

BAL @ DET, Friday, August 15, 2008 Game Preview – Baseball-Reference.com

Game Time 7:05

POSTGAME: Awful. I don’t leave early often, but we left in the 9th. Coincidentally just as the scoreboard announced Michael Phelps 7th gold medal – inspiring a cheer from a pissed off crowd.

Only this year could that ridiculous play with Polanco happen. I don’t think it was intentional, but regardless Polanco still had a brain lapse when he didn’t immediately pick up the ball allowing another run to score. It ended up being a moot point when what should have been an inning ending play turned into batting practice.

Nate Robertson wasn’t good again. This isn’t excuse making at all, but I’m just going to point something out. Coming into tonight, Robertson had a 942 OPS against when Inge was catching (8 games). This includes the infamous bed crappings against Baltimore and Cleveland. Robertson’s best start of late came when Dane Sardinha was catching. It’s likely a coincidence, but I’m just saying.

Speaking of Inge, he was awful tonight. He missed the throw from Magglio Ordonez in the second inning. It would have been close to cutting down the first run, but his nonchalance allowed the second run to score. Oddly he never took his mask off in that sequence. He also short circuited two different whipping boy rallies. It’s never a good sign when the guy after you leads off 3 different innings.

Miguel Cabrera had his struggles as well with an 0′fer night.

It was just a really bad game that turned really ugly.

 
 

{ 50 comments }

Amanda August 15, 2008 at 7:05 pm

*tip toes in* just listening to the itunes I downloaded getting ready for the Tigers vs. Orioles game. Wish I would of knew about the DTW OPen Chat.. I probably wouldn’t of went out to lunch at TGI Friday’s..GRRR Though it was good and the beer even better. Well if I had been here I would of asked about the chances of Matt Joyce being a part of the 2009 Tiger Team. To me he has faltered a bit. But not being as smart as most of the bloggers on the stats and all..that might not necessarily be the case. Go Tigers! Always nice to see them win whether playoff bound or not

billfer August 15, 2008 at 7:06 pm

If Nate doesn’t get calls tonight here’s why. One of his warm up tosses crossed up Inge and drilled the ump in the throat.

mcb August 15, 2008 at 7:25 pm

Nate is back to throwing bp

Mark in Chicago August 15, 2008 at 7:31 pm

oh that was just ugly.

mcb August 15, 2008 at 7:33 pm

Pathetic

Brian P August 15, 2008 at 7:35 pm

Nate should get the error that inning. He walked the number nine hitter to “get to” Brian Roberts.

Ken Rosenthal said we might trade him if he pitches well the rest of the season. Not gonna happen.

sky August 15, 2008 at 7:38 pm

Wait a minute.someone help me out please. All I saw was a throw home that went right by Inge as if he didn’t even reach to catch it. I must have missed something……….anyone know? I know the walk was a mistake, but the play and replay looked like Inge wasn’t even watching the throw and had no idea he was expected to catch it!

Amanda August 15, 2008 at 7:55 pm

The kick ball game in the backyard of my apt complex is more exciting than this game :|

chris August 15, 2008 at 7:56 pm

Nate resumes his place as the worst starter in MLB

Rick G August 15, 2008 at 8:03 pm

Sky, please don’t tell me you’re being critical of Inge. Of course Magglio deserved an error for throwing that nearly perfect short hop to the plate. /sarc

At yesterday’s game our beloved Brandon got a nice cheer for not grounding into a double play. I’m dead serious, that really happened.

Brian P August 15, 2008 at 8:09 pm

Bill Hohn just took out his HBP frustration out on Cabrera. Rude.

Mike in CT August 15, 2008 at 8:09 pm

Wait a second…Bilfer suggested Robertson as a closer option for 2008? That means his terribl-osity more than once or twice a week? That’s a good idea?

sky August 15, 2008 at 8:10 pm

Well, goodnight all. I am going to try to find an old movie or something to watch.

Mark in Chicago August 15, 2008 at 8:10 pm

Cabrera had a point, that pitch was way off the plate according to Gameday. Horrible call.

Sean C. in Illinois August 15, 2008 at 8:12 pm

Sorry to interject, but it’ll be relevant later:

EDGAR RENTERIA WITH MEN ON SINCE THE BREAK

Play (bases occupied, outs, pitches) WPA%

WALK (1B, 1 OUT, 5P) +5%
GDP 5-4-3 (1B, 1 OUT, 2P) -3%
SINGLE RF (1B-2B, 1 OUT, 2P) +7%
GDP 5-4-3 (1B, 0 OUT, 1P) -8%
FORCEOUT 1-6 (1B, 1 OUT, 1P) -7%
OUT 5-3 NO ADV (2B, 0 OUT, 3P) -1%
STRIKEOUT (1B, 1 OUT, 4P) -3%
FORCEOUT 5-4 (1B, 0 OUT, 4P) -4%
OUT POP-4 (1B, 1 OUT, 2P) 0
OUT 4-3 (1B-2B-3B, 2 OUT, 4P) 0
OUT LINE-7 (1B, 2 OUT, 7P) -2%
SINGLE LF (3B, 1 OUT, 3P) +5% RBI
STRIKEOUT (1B, 2 OUT, 3P) -2%
OUT LINE-4 (2B, 2 OUT, 3P) -3%
SINGLE BUNT-5 (1B, 0 OUT, 1P) +3%
DOUBLE CF (1B, 1 OUT, 1P) +4% RBI
GDP 5-4-3 (1B, 1 OUT, 1P) -2%
OUT GROUND-3 ADVANCE (1B, 1 OUT, 2P) -2%
DOUBLE LF (2B-3B, 2 OUT, 6P) +17% 2 RBI
OUT LINE-6 (2B, 2 OUT, 6P) -1%
OUT LINE-8 (1B, 1 OUT, 2P) -1%
OUT FLY-9 (1B, 2 OUT, 6P) -1%
STRIKEOUT (1B-2B, 1 OUT, 4P) -11%
GDP 1-6-3 (1B, 1 OUT, 6P) -14%
OUT FLY-8 ADVANCE (1B-2B, 1 OUT, 6P) ?
OUT FLY-9 (1B-2B, 1 OUT, 5P) ?
OUT 5-3 (3B, 2 OUT, 4P) -3%
OUT 6-3 (1B, 2 OUT, 7P) -3%
OUT LINE-5 DP (1B, 1 OUT, 2P) -5%
WALK (1B, 2 OUT, 9P) +2%
WALK (1B, 2 OUT, 5P) +2%
OUT 5-3 ADVANCE (1B, 0 OUT, 2P) 0
WALK (1B, 2 OUT, 6P) +3%
INTENTIONAL WALK (2B, 2 OUT, 4P) +1%
SINGLE CF (1B, 0 OUT, 4P) +5%
OUT FLY-9 (1B, 1 OUT, 2P) -2%
FORCEOUT 5-4 (1B, 0 OUT, 4P) -1%
DOUBLE RF (2B-3B, 2 OUT, 3P) +10% 2 RBI
OUT FLY-7 (1B, 0 OUT, 2P) -7%
DOUBLE CF (1B-2B-3B, 2 OUT, 1P) +31% 2 RBI

RISP: 7 RBI/14 PA, .385/.429/.615 = 1.044 OPS, WPA +52%/14 PA = +3.7%

MEN ON: 8 RBI/39 PA, ,235/..333/.353 = .686 OPS, WPA +9%/39 PA = +0.2%, 4 DP in 32 GDP situations, 3 K, 5 BB

STREAKS: 10 consecutive outs. 6 consecutive productive AB.

MEN ON PASS/FAIL: 38.4% / 61.6%

RISP PASS/FAIL: 50% / 50%

sky August 15, 2008 at 8:21 pm

Just one last message for DD and JL: if you felt you had to prove in April that the team really wasn’t reliable, and then thought it would be neat to bring them to .500 twice since then, just to toy with the feelings of the fans, and then drop it all as the final chance to even break .500 came, you succeeded.

You know, it’s tolerable to lose. But it is sickening to see a team that is paid this much, with such a long history of great fan support, and great competition, become something of a joke, or even less than a joke. Perhaps the word is “absurd.”

We have hung on for several months of ups and downs, hoping to see something finally develop that engenders pride. But it has not happened, and it is evident that it will not.

judpma August 15, 2008 at 8:21 pm

Chris: Nate resumes his place as the worst starter in MLB

quite a accomplishment really …you just can’t go out there and do that very easily…but he is consistent which makes that honor a little easier for him to attain game after game after game after game… despite his one single gem last week

Mike in CT August 15, 2008 at 8:22 pm

So Sean…in English?

Amanda August 15, 2008 at 8:26 pm

Jeepers ya.. my calculator started smoking then exploded..what does that all mean? break it down for us brotha

Rick G August 15, 2008 at 8:38 pm

Holy crap Sean C. – I have a degree in math and have followed baseball since I was 5, and I still have no idea what those numbers could possibly mean!

At least there’s some drama tonight, will Sean let us in on what all those numbers mean??? Does Renteria suck or what?

judpma August 15, 2008 at 8:39 pm

…. so that the Tigers won’t have the worst starting pitcher the worst DH and the worst 9 hitter all in the same year they moved Inge to the 8 spot…clever

billfer August 15, 2008 at 8:46 pm

I can’t believe Nates going to be back out. No one warming up.

judpma August 15, 2008 at 8:50 pm

it will take Nate 5 batters to give those two runs back…..

judpma August 15, 2008 at 8:53 pm

why would you bunt against Robertson…just wait until he grooves another one or walks you….?????

Rick G August 15, 2008 at 8:55 pm

judpma, they could put Inge at 3rd base, bat him 8th, let Sardinha catch and bat 9th. Then they’d have the worst pitcher, catcher, DH, and hitting 3B since the Bad News Bears (beginning of the season, of course).

Maybe Morris Buttermaker could coach these guys up? He drinks instead of smokes, so that might be a welcome change. His post game clubhouse interviews wouldn’t be any less intelligible, that’s for sure.

judpma August 15, 2008 at 8:57 pm

hey Rick all this and we haven’t brought up the “bull” pen at all..I think we have something going here I nominate Don Zimmer to coach first base

Amanda August 15, 2008 at 9:02 pm

Sean C. is gonna help us out as soon as he finds an available phone booth to change into “ColeMan”

Ryan August 15, 2008 at 9:14 pm

Sorry to be the voice of reason, but Sheffield is a much, much, much better DH than Jose Vidro (.234/.274/.338). And Jack Hannahan (.223/.310/.332) is inferior at 3B. I’d say Sardinha’s bat is about as bad as you can do. There are four pitchers with at least 100 IP with a higher WHIP than Nate’s 1.61 (okay, three. Zito doesn’t count)(okay, two. Livan doesn’t count either). Kenny’s 1.55 is only a little better. Both worse than Eddie Bonine. I think you could safely say the Tigers have the worst fourth/fifth starting pitching in the majors.

Rick G August 15, 2008 at 10:02 pm

Tommy Lasorda to coach 3rd? That All Star Game tumble was pure comedy gold.

Sorry, judpma, I was occupied for a while – had to bring the wife and kids warmer clothes for movie night at the swim club. Good thing we’ve got global warming, otherwise there’s no telling how cold it would be tonight!

I see Sean is leaving us all hanging on the Renteria front…

russ August 15, 2008 at 10:05 pm

What happened on that play at second? I’m at the game and missed it.

Rick G August 15, 2008 at 10:08 pm

The runner threw his hands up as he slid into 2nd base and deflected the ball. Could’ve been interference, but the umps must’ve ruled it to be accidental.

Nice getting those replays at the park, isn’t it?

Kevin in Austin August 15, 2008 at 10:13 pm

It looked like it was accidental to me. PP sure felt otherwise. Likely it didn’t matter either way, other than further blowing up TJs ERA. 38 pitches to get 2 outs.

Rick G August 15, 2008 at 10:20 pm

Way to go Jonesey, picking up right where you left off.

I’m starting to worry about Sean, maybe he had an aneurysm trying to crunch all those Renteria numbers, or is possibly choking on a ham sandwich.

Mike in CT August 15, 2008 at 10:29 pm

So much for Leyland whole, “playing for pride” b.s.

Ryan August 15, 2008 at 10:34 pm

So much for Leyland? Pleasepleaseplease.

Ryan August 15, 2008 at 10:37 pm

Larry Parrish as a September call-up. Book it.

greg August 15, 2008 at 10:59 pm

This isn’t being negative, just being real, the Royals and Indians both look like much better baseball teams….and not just right now, for most of the year. It would be a mild surprise if the Tigers stayed out of last place this year.

Sean C. in Illinois August 15, 2008 at 11:18 pm

Not a good game, I take it. I was busy. Good thing, apparently. Losing the opener to the Orioles is taking getting a head start on meeting my 11-17 projection for August a little too seriously, in my view. But I appreciate the effort, the advance work – I’m the same way.

Hey, what was so confusing about my Renteria post? It’s just a list of his PA with men on since the break, in order, followed by a breakdown. Followed by an aneurysm. No, really – it’s simple:

Renteria has been excellent in limited RISP opportunities since the break. Timely, big impact excellence. However, with men on in general… not so good. Per usual. Also runs hot and cold, also per usual.

So the answer to the question, are his “hot’ numbers since the break a stat-padding illusion, is a very simple yes and no.

Man, this ColeMan outfit is way too big. I thought the guy at the thrift shop was kidding when he told me the previous owner was Marlon Brando.

By the way, the point to Robertson moving to the pen is this: He’s a lefty who can throw strikes. He can put together 2-3 good innings no sweat. But almost never 4 or 5. He’s 30, not likely on the ascent, and his ceiling as a starter is clearly not good enough for this team. Instead of giving up, why not find out whether there’s a hidden talent waiting for a new role?

judpma August 15, 2008 at 11:53 pm

I don’t think Robertson ,Jones or Inge got the memo about win some for the Gipper..I mean Ilitch

Coleman August 16, 2008 at 12:44 am

Rick G: “Sky, please don’t tell me you’re being critical of Inge. Of course Magglio deserved an error for throwing that nearly perfect short hop to the plate. /sarc

At yesterday’s game our beloved Brandon got a nice cheer for not grounding into a double play. I’m dead serious, that really happened.”

Wow, that’s pretty silly. Since that’s the one fault you don’t have to worry about with Inge (1 DP in >220 AB, best on the team and one of the best in the AL)

Coleman August 16, 2008 at 12:51 am

I have much more to say but first I must locate my clothing because it is no easy thing to find the place with internet access and a tolerance for lack of clothing both.

ron August 16, 2008 at 12:58 am

Sean C. that ninth stat from the bottom, Shoo Fly Shoo. What is that?

stephen August 16, 2008 at 1:43 am

Wow, Inge batting .216 and proving to be a bad game caller and an indifferent catcher. Color me shocked. I wonder if he has any idea how close he is to playing Japan or nowhere.

stephen August 16, 2008 at 1:58 am

The great thing about Inge? His career numbers are so awful that his OBP, OPS, and slugging % this year are actually above his career averages, truly remarkable adventures in awfulness.

ron August 16, 2008 at 4:06 am

My apologies Sean, while studying your stats on Renteria, I blacked out for a few moments and awoke to the nursery rhyme of shoo fly s hoo playing over and over in my head. I myself being an Arithmetic Major at the prestigous St. Patrick School , I could not make heads or tails of those stats and your follow up explanation left a lot to be desired. I am now convinced that you are a “group of people” called Sean: maybe Sam, Eddie, Andy and Nancy, who are not always on the same page. It took you some time to get back to Rick G. Trouble Coordinating?

jim-mt August 16, 2008 at 11:00 am

It hurts me to defend Inge, but Magglio did get an throwing error on that play by short-hopping it.

Ryan August 16, 2008 at 1:31 pm

Let me be the first to welcome you to the Tigers, Ramon Hernandez. It won’t be official for a couple months, but this is the day when the decision was made.

Sean C. in Illinois August 16, 2008 at 2:36 pm

Ron: Another translation of the stats on ER: If he had hit like he has since the break all season, he’d look like a slightly lesser cross between Polanco and Guillen and be on course for 70-80 RBI (because he’d never be hitting lower than #7). No one would be complaining about him or the trade, and you would have to look deeper into the stats to find weakness than you do now.

If this is the real Renteria, he’s defensible as adequate for 2009. I stlll lean toward thinking of him as badequate and that the Tigers could do better at a vital position. I don’t want Guillen at 3B, either. I want a change at at least one of these 2 positions for 2009.

Sean C. in Illinois August 16, 2008 at 3:08 pm

A lesson:

Play (bases occupied, outs, pitches) WPA%

WALK (1B, 1 OUT, 5P) +5%
GDP 5-4-3 (1B, 1 OUT, 2P) -3%
SINGLE RF (1B-2B, 1 OUT, 2P) +7%

Line 1: With a man on first and one out, Renteria walks on 5 pitches. As a result, Tigers are 5% more likely to win the game.*

Line 2: With a man on first and one out, Renteria Grounds into a Double Play third to second to first (5-4-3) on the second pitch. As a result, Tigers are 3% more likely to lose the game.

Line 3: With men on first and second and one out, Renteria singles to right field on the second pitch, loading the bases. As a result, Tigers are 7% more likely to win the game.

* based on score and situation compared against a vast database of historical game records.

ron August 17, 2008 at 2:50 am

Thanks Sean C. I grew up way before such data was readily available. The newspaper was my sole source and still is. I don’t want to know this much about any one player. It’s a game of futility anyways. The Tigers could statistically field the best team, have no injuries, have (4 )20-game winners, win 115 games and still be World Series Losers similar to the 54′ Indians. If you were an Indian fan in 54′, you’d throw your hands up and wonder what happened. Heart and desire can’t be measured and I truly think is a big part of the game. Go ahead and skewer me, what the heck do I know? Nice job dumming it down though. You took the time. Appreciate it.

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