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Chris in Nashville
October 2, 2007 at 5:05 pm
I found it interesting that the AL and NL Comeback Player of the Year were both former Tigers..Pena in the AL and DY in the NL. Both deserving, but both had to go when they did.
October 2, 2007 at 5:08 pm
Billfer, thanks for the BA link. No disrespect to Jim Callis, I respect him, but it sounds as though he’s only seen Grandy in small doses. In my mind, he’s easily the best defensive CF in baseball. He’s got it all, speed, range, web gems in buckets, and an absolute rocket/laser for an arm. If someone has a stronger arm, it would be superfluous, unless your goal is to throw it above and beyond the backstop and out of the stadium and into the parking lot. Granderson can throw a laser from deep center to home on the fly. He can be a little wild at times. But there’s no questioning the arm strength. Granderson is probably a future HOF and a gold glover NOW in CF, he’s earned it, not to mention he is one of the classiest athletes in the bigs, don’t move him.
Now, if Maybin really is all that. That’s something to get really, REALLY excited about if you’re a Tigers fan. No question that Maybin has a rocket as well. But make him learn Left Field, perhaps he’ll continue to blossom and be ready mid season to man left.
Has anyone seen Gorkys play? They talked about him at the fan fest this year. Looking forward to seeing him at Comerica one day as well.
October 2, 2007 at 5:14 pm
Chris – I found that interesting also.
What an amazing defensive outfield that would be!
October 2, 2007 at 5:39 pm
I agree with Greg there…I don’t see why all these people want Granderson out of CF….He’s AMAZING out there and I’m not convinced Gorkys or Maybin would be better at him at tracking balls in the CF in that ball park. Curtis’s routes to flly balls are second to none and while Maybin and/or Gorkys might be more physically tooled to be better CF than Curtis, they probably aren’t as smart as he is. I’d prefer to have Curtis to stay in CF as long as he possibly can and let the other 2 play on the corners. And Greg, the reason why he suggested Maybin in right is because typically, your strongest armed OF plays RF, which it sounds like Mayin is. All that being said…I still think Maggs has some good years ahead of him, so lets lay off that talk for a while!
Joey the K
October 2, 2007 at 5:54 pm
Grandy is money in CF, I love having him out there. Watching the Padres/Rox game last night and seeing Brady Clark flail around in CF made me appreciate Curtis even more.
October 2, 2007 at 6:39 pm
Curtis was amazing this past year in most aspects, but a HOF?
Maybe if he repeats something close to that over 12+ seasons.
His arm is not strong, though. But CF normally do not have strong throwing arms. His range and the jumps he gets on most balls are very good to excellent.
Maybin has looked poor, but I think he will improve quite a bit over the next few years working with Van Slyke.
October 2, 2007 at 6:51 pm
Greg: I want my Hall of Famers to hit at least .200 against lefties. Call me crazy.
October 2, 2007 at 7:06 pm
That is a bit unfair Stephen…last year was only his 2nd full MLB season as a starter..hitting lefties will come with time. I’m not ready to put him in Cooperstown or anything by any stretch, but I guarantee he will work on it this offseason and improve. He struck out alot this year, but it wasn’t nearly as bad as last year, so he’s shown the ability to improve. I think he’ll hit over .250 against lefties next year. Ok, I hope he does.
October 2, 2007 at 7:11 pm
I said PROBABLY a FUTURE Hall of Famer
Of course. He’s still very young and continues to improve. We haven’t seen his peak yet. Most project players to peak age 26-27.
His arm is not strong, though.
I disagree. What is your criteria for strong? Perhaps he hasn’t displayed it when you’ve watched him. I’ve seen him display what I consider ‘extremely strong’ a few times both in person and on TV.
To me, being deep in CF Comerica Park and hitting the catcher chest high with a laser on the fly is strong, I don’t see most other CF’s do that, most bounce it in, at least when I watch them.. Another time was deep in CF and launched a laser/rocket a mile over the catcher’s head. In my opinion, that’s strong, not accurate, but strong. He needs to improve his accuracy no doubt, but he’s not 34, he’s very young, give him time.
October 2, 2007 at 7:15 pm
You’re absolutely right,Greg-I’ve heard when Curtis “Rocket Man” throws his lasers from CF to home,an imprint of the baseball’s seams is left in the catcher’s mitt.Not only is he a cinch for the HoF,but I expect him to get an Oscar and a Nobel Prize as well,then be elected President in 2042.
October 2, 2007 at 7:21 pm
I think Granderson has an above average arm that plays well in centerfield, but I wouldn’t call it outstanding by any means and it would probably be merely average in right field.
As for Hall of Fame, the possibility is there given what we saw in his age 26 season, but keep in mind he’s starting fairly late for a Hall of Fame type player meaning he’ll have to be a very special player for the next 10-12 years to sniff the Hall. It will be tough for his career to be long enough to qualify under the very-good-for-a-long-time route and instead he’ll need a string of excellence.
As for whether or not he gets bumped from center it’s really too early to know. But from what I’ve heard Hernandez has Maybin like speed and takes good routes and has good instincts.
October 2, 2007 at 7:25 pm
My point exactly. If he doesn’t play against lefties he’ll hit .000 against them. I don’t want that.
Unexpected, so many have pigeon-holed Curtis as a platoon player. A part timer as his upside…….
October 2, 2007 at 7:33 pm
billfer – thanks for the tidbit. I’ll make a slight qualification to my statements based on it. For some reason I thought he was younger than that, around 24, and I was assuming a significant power increase in the next 3-4 year window. But since he’s 26, I’d see his upside as slightly less in that case.
I still think the tools/potential are there, given his work ethic dedication etc. to having HOF upside. But at 26 it changes my opinion a little.
Still the best CF in baseball right now, IMHO.
October 2, 2007 at 8:17 pm
Yep he is 26, oh and I have seen just about every Tigers game (prob. 98%) since I was seven or eight.
He doesn’t have an exceptional arm. CF do not need great arms (in COPA it might help alittle) they need range and aton of it which is what he has.
I’m a big fan of his but saying he is ridiculous at all facets of the game is something I’m sure he himself would disagree with – which is what is going to make him a great to exceptional player hopefully.
This past year he displayed extreme power and pop (hard line drives) – like half of his hits were for extra bases.
He also showed of his speed with his 20+ steals, triples and was tied with Ichiro for the lead in MLB for PO for CF.
He also as has been well documented by the Detroit media at least been comparable to Sean Casey in how he conducts himself. He is very fan-friendly and even thanks the fans.
I have read probably 80-90% of what he has wrote in his blog over the summer. He is a good guy who works hard and gets the most out of his abilities and seems to always be looking to improve and help others.
Great OF arms are Ichiro, Vlad, Jose Guillen, Higgi (in his prime). etc.
BTW I found this interesting and something I never knew – what a 5’9 Ichiro would do in HS “Among the strength drills he performed in training there were hurling car tires and hitting wiffleballs with a heavy shovel.” – Wikipedia
But he still has things to improve on and has only this one season to go off of. It was a D@mn good season and I hope he repeats it in ’08.
October 2, 2007 at 8:19 pm
one really good season”
October 2, 2007 at 8:47 pm
Granderson has a below average outfield arm.The only reason his assist total is as high as it is comes from him playing such a shallow centerfield.That and the fact that baserunners feel it’s safe to run on him.
While generally speaking a right fielder needs the most arm in order to make the throw to third base,it’s inaccurate to say that a strong arm isn’t necessary for a CF.Some of the best throwing arms in the game today belong to centerfielders-Jones,Hunter,Kotsay,Suzuki(okay,converted rightfielder),Edmunds.Willie Mays arm was legendary.At the same time,the best outfield throwing arms I’ve watched over the years virtually all belonged to rightfielders-Kaline,Colavito,Maris,Clemente,Evans,Barfield,Gwynn,Parker.Guillen and Guerrero have world class arms in RF.Francouer in Atlanta has an exceptional arm as well.
Granderson is not anywhere close to any of the guys listed above.More of a 4.5 tool guy.
October 2, 2007 at 8:50 pm
Also,Sizemore’s arm is also below average,especially for a guy who supposedly was recruited to play Division 1 football as a quarterback.
Greg- other Greg
October 2, 2007 at 10:02 pm
I’m curious how you would define a ‘below average’ arm. If you’re combining strength and accuracy into your definition, if you’re talking stats of throwing people out or something, ok, I understand. But if you’re talking strength, the pure ability to throw it the needed distance on the fly, I don’t understand the consensus opinion here arm after what I’ve seen.
Granted it was a horrible throw, but I’ve never seen anyone throw it farther than Curtis did on one occassion when he overthrew the catcher by a mile from deep CF. Not that Vlad and the other scouldn’t do it if they wanted(obviously they’d never try it in a game as it would hurt the team).
October 3, 2007 at 7:59 am
Strength and accuracy with consistency.
October 3, 2007 at 8:48 am
Curtis Granderson could throw with his feet for all I care as long as he’s worth 33 runs defensively in a season in CF, tied with Ichiro for the best in baseball.
And compared to Grady Sizemore and his value of -18.9 runs, I’ll gladly take Granderson’s “below average” throwing arm.
October 3, 2007 at 10:33 am
Mike R,Granderson’s +/- would be seriously effected by him throwing with his feet.You should care.
The discussion was initiated by someone commenting on Granderson’s arm strength.Some of us disagree.No one disagrees that his glovework and range are equal or better than most all other center fielders in baseball,including Sizemore,with whom he shares average at best throwing skills.
Sorry to hurt your feelings.
October 3, 2007 at 8:06 pm
You didn’t hurt my feelings. A throwing arm from Granderson is the last thing I’m thinking about considering the amount of ground he has to cover in CF at Comerica with a potential outfield of Marcus Thames and Magglio Ordonez surrounding him.
His defense this year was so good that his arm is a complete non-factor. An outfielder will always save more runs by having above average range then having a gun for an arm. I think it’s honestly overrated, especially from the CF position.
October 4, 2007 at 8:09 am
It’s overrated until it’s needed.
If Giles hadn’t thrown the rainbow from rightfield that he did the Padres might be in the playoffs.
October 4, 2007 at 12:05 pm
Granderson is Mr.Tiger. He should play every game til he asks for a day off. He”ll be better against lefties next year.
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