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	<title>Comments on: World Series Game 3: Aftermath</title>
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		<title>By: Dirty Carl Sports &#187; Blog Archive &#187; World Series Blogdome: Detroit at St. Louis, Game 3</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22541</link>
		<dc:creator>Dirty Carl Sports &#187; Blog Archive &#187; World Series Blogdome: Detroit at St. Louis, Game 3</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Oct 2006 00:13:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22541</guid>
		<description>[...] &#8226; The Detroit Tigers Weblog. It&#8217;s not so much the loss that is troubling. I actually expected Detroit to lose this game just based on the pitching match-up. It&#8217;s that once again they looked so incredibly bad in losing. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] &#8226; The Detroit Tigers Weblog. It&#8217;s not so much the loss that is troubling. I actually expected Detroit to lose this game just based on the pitching match-up. It&#8217;s that once again they looked so incredibly bad in losing. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: billfer</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22203</link>
		<dc:creator>billfer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 20:08:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22203</guid>
		<description>Matt - 

Those are some good points, and when it comes to patience and discipline a couple things are at work.  

One thing is swinging at strikes versus swinging at pitches you can hit.  I think part of the Tigers problem isn&#039;t that they are swining at pitches out of the strike zone.  It&#039;s that they&#039;re going after pitches they can&#039;t do much with.  When you&#039;re down 2 strikes in the count you don&#039;t have a choice.  But early on you don&#039;t have to swing at the first strike you see.

Second, the problem becomes much exaggerated when they don&#039;t hit the pitches they&#039;re swining at well.  If they&#039;re getting hits on first pitch fastballs, nobody cares.  There&#039;s something to being aggressive with fastballs early in the count, but when the entire team isn&#039;t driving those balls on one night, you have a disaster.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Matt &#8211; </p>
<p>Those are some good points, and when it comes to patience and discipline a couple things are at work.  </p>
<p>One thing is swinging at strikes versus swinging at pitches you can hit.  I think part of the Tigers problem isn&#8217;t that they are swining at pitches out of the strike zone.  It&#8217;s that they&#8217;re going after pitches they can&#8217;t do much with.  When you&#8217;re down 2 strikes in the count you don&#8217;t have a choice.  But early on you don&#8217;t have to swing at the first strike you see.</p>
<p>Second, the problem becomes much exaggerated when they don&#8217;t hit the pitches they&#8217;re swining at well.  If they&#8217;re getting hits on first pitch fastballs, nobody cares.  There&#8217;s something to being aggressive with fastballs early in the count, but when the entire team isn&#8217;t driving those balls on one night, you have a disaster.</p>
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		<title>By: Matt in Toledo</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22201</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt in Toledo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 19:59:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22201</guid>
		<description>There is a lot of discussion about Carpenter and the Cardinals throwing so few pitches. I did some digging, and I think this is more a credit to the Cardinals than a strike against the Tigers. 

The Tigers saw 91 pitches and only swung at 42. That doesn&#039;t sound too &quot;hacky&quot; to me, although I admittedly don&#039;t know what the usual percentage is. 

The Tigers&#039; batters swung at only 6 of the 29 first pitches they saw. Of the 23 they took, 14 were balls, so Carpenter was trying to get them to bite on first pitches out of the zone, but they weren&#039;t going for them for the most part. 

The Tigers&#039; batters swung and missed only 7 times all night, and 6 of those were strike three pitches. That&#039;s understandable since if you kind of have to swing at close pitches with two strikes against you. (I know; at least a couple of those third strike pitches weren&#039;t strikes)

I think the Tigers&#039; bigger problem is that they have trouble identifying hittable pitches. Consider that of the 49 pitches they watched, 20 were called strikes. I&#039;d love to see those 20 pitches compared to the 42 they swung at. My guess is that Tiger batters go up there thinking they&#039;re going to work the count in such and such a way, and end up being mechanical and predictable as far as what pitches they swing at, and what pitches they don&#039;t. In other words, they&#039;re trying to be patient for patience sake, rather than being patient in order to make sure they&#039;re swinging at the pitches they can do the most damage with.

Of course, Carpenter had a lot to do with this since he seemed to be making his pitches almost all night.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a lot of discussion about Carpenter and the Cardinals throwing so few pitches. I did some digging, and I think this is more a credit to the Cardinals than a strike against the Tigers. </p>
<p>The Tigers saw 91 pitches and only swung at 42. That doesn&#8217;t sound too &#8220;hacky&#8221; to me, although I admittedly don&#8217;t know what the usual percentage is. </p>
<p>The Tigers&#8217; batters swung at only 6 of the 29 first pitches they saw. Of the 23 they took, 14 were balls, so Carpenter was trying to get them to bite on first pitches out of the zone, but they weren&#8217;t going for them for the most part. </p>
<p>The Tigers&#8217; batters swung and missed only 7 times all night, and 6 of those were strike three pitches. That&#8217;s understandable since if you kind of have to swing at close pitches with two strikes against you. (I know; at least a couple of those third strike pitches weren&#8217;t strikes)</p>
<p>I think the Tigers&#8217; bigger problem is that they have trouble identifying hittable pitches. Consider that of the 49 pitches they watched, 20 were called strikes. I&#8217;d love to see those 20 pitches compared to the 42 they swung at. My guess is that Tiger batters go up there thinking they&#8217;re going to work the count in such and such a way, and end up being mechanical and predictable as far as what pitches they swing at, and what pitches they don&#8217;t. In other words, they&#8217;re trying to be patient for patience sake, rather than being patient in order to make sure they&#8217;re swinging at the pitches they can do the most damage with.</p>
<p>Of course, Carpenter had a lot to do with this since he seemed to be making his pitches almost all night.</p>
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		<title>By: Bobber</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22200</link>
		<dc:creator>Bobber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 19:49:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22200</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s too bad Zumaya misfired his throw to Inge. I think it&#039;s the type of gutsy move that we see almost never, and obviously the outcome of this one won&#039;t enhance the probability of seeing it again.

I have to wonder if, when Zumaya lined up third base in his sights, he surprised Inge to the point that it threw his own timing off enough in the execution to bring disaster.

I&#039;ve seen that happen before.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s too bad Zumaya misfired his throw to Inge. I think it&#8217;s the type of gutsy move that we see almost never, and obviously the outcome of this one won&#8217;t enhance the probability of seeing it again.</p>
<p>I have to wonder if, when Zumaya lined up third base in his sights, he surprised Inge to the point that it threw his own timing off enough in the execution to bring disaster.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve seen that happen before.</p>
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		<title>By: Ryan S</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22197</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan S</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 19:41:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22197</guid>
		<description>One more positive to take from last night&#039;s game: Leyland finally figured out the proper way to use Neifi.  Late inning defensive replacement, then immediately pinch hit for.  

Better late than never...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One more positive to take from last night&#8217;s game: Leyland finally figured out the proper way to use Neifi.  Late inning defensive replacement, then immediately pinch hit for.  </p>
<p>Better late than never&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: The Aftermath: Game 3 &#171; Baseball By Paul</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22186</link>
		<dc:creator>The Aftermath: Game 3 &#171; Baseball By Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 18:57:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22186</guid>
		<description>[...] Per Billfer at DTW , no batter reached a three-ball count all night. That is downright vomit-inducing. The lack of discipline led to a whopping one runner in scoring position all evening. Overall, despite some very predictable pitch-calling by Carpenter and Yadier Molina, the Tigers remained lost. That isn&#8217;t to take anything from Carpenter. Predictable or not, filth is filth and will fool major league hitters regardless. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Per Billfer at DTW , no batter reached a three-ball count all night. That is downright vomit-inducing. The lack of discipline led to a whopping one runner in scoring position all evening. Overall, despite some very predictable pitch-calling by Carpenter and Yadier Molina, the Tigers remained lost. That isn&#8217;t to take anything from Carpenter. Predictable or not, filth is filth and will fool major league hitters regardless. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22170</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 17:14:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22170</guid>
		<description>The Tigers led the league this year (during the regular season) in games they won while scoring 3 runs or less.  

The problem with that stat in this World Series is twofold - 

1.  Our offense generated &lt;b&gt;2 runs&lt;/b&gt; in Game 1, &lt;b&gt;3 runs&lt;/b&gt; in Game 2, and &lt;b&gt;0 Runs&lt;/b&gt; in Game 3.

2.  Our Pitching gave up 7 runs in the Game 1 loss and 5 runs last night.

Can you imagine if Todd Jones had not pulled out the save in Game 2 with the bases jammed?  Wow.  It would all be over but the crying right about now.

Current MVP of the series for the Tigers? 

Co-MVP Award goes to Rogers &amp; Jones.  

Yikes.  We need some offense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Tigers led the league this year (during the regular season) in games they won while scoring 3 runs or less.  </p>
<p>The problem with that stat in this World Series is twofold &#8211; </p>
<p>1.  Our offense generated <b>2 runs</b> in Game 1, <b>3 runs</b> in Game 2, and <b>0 Runs</b> in Game 3.</p>
<p>2.  Our Pitching gave up 7 runs in the Game 1 loss and 5 runs last night.</p>
<p>Can you imagine if Todd Jones had not pulled out the save in Game 2 with the bases jammed?  Wow.  It would all be over but the crying right about now.</p>
<p>Current MVP of the series for the Tigers? </p>
<p>Co-MVP Award goes to Rogers &amp; Jones.  </p>
<p>Yikes.  We need some offense.</p>
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		<title>By: Kyle J</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22169</link>
		<dc:creator>Kyle J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 17:13:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22169</guid>
		<description>Only real comfort at this point is that the Cardinals haven&#039;t exactly been hitting the cover off the ball, either.

Tigers through three games: .185/.227/.293
Cardinals through three games: .196/.304/.320

If Bonderman comes out throwing strikes tonight (or tomorrow night), I think the game will swing to us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Only real comfort at this point is that the Cardinals haven&#8217;t exactly been hitting the cover off the ball, either.</p>
<p>Tigers through three games: .185/.227/.293<br />
Cardinals through three games: .196/.304/.320</p>
<p>If Bonderman comes out throwing strikes tonight (or tomorrow night), I think the game will swing to us.</p>
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		<title>By: Joey C.</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22151</link>
		<dc:creator>Joey C.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 15:38:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22151</guid>
		<description>Charly I think you&#039;re prediction is crazy...but I like it!

This Tiger offense has been ridiculously streaky all year and they hit rough patches that lasted well longer than 7 games.  So I&#039;m pretty concerned with what I&#039;m seeing.  The one game we did win was due to another Kenny masterpiece as our offense failed to knock in a ton of men on base.  Were our bats going well we would&#039;ve scored at least six runs in game 2.

I was really hoping the Tigers would come in and keep the pedal down, because the Cards arms were tired coming in on the heels of a 7 game series.  Instead, we&#039;ve hardly even seen their bullpen.  We need to make their pitchers work a little, and we certainly didn&#039;t come close to doing that last night.

Anyway, I&#039;m looking forward to tonight&#039;s 11 run outburst.

Go Tigers!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Charly I think you&#8217;re prediction is crazy&#8230;but I like it!</p>
<p>This Tiger offense has been ridiculously streaky all year and they hit rough patches that lasted well longer than 7 games.  So I&#8217;m pretty concerned with what I&#8217;m seeing.  The one game we did win was due to another Kenny masterpiece as our offense failed to knock in a ton of men on base.  Were our bats going well we would&#8217;ve scored at least six runs in game 2.</p>
<p>I was really hoping the Tigers would come in and keep the pedal down, because the Cards arms were tired coming in on the heels of a 7 game series.  Instead, we&#8217;ve hardly even seen their bullpen.  We need to make their pitchers work a little, and we certainly didn&#8217;t come close to doing that last night.</p>
<p>Anyway, I&#8217;m looking forward to tonight&#8217;s 11 run outburst.</p>
<p>Go Tigers!</p>
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		<title>By: Kyle J</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22149</link>
		<dc:creator>Kyle J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 15:10:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22149</guid>
		<description>Weather doesn&#039;t look promising for tonight.  If the game is delayed until tomorrow night, I assume there would be no travel day and games 6 and 7 would be Saturday/Sunday?  In that case, Suppan wouldn&#039;t be able to pitch twice in the series--only two days of rest between games 4 and 7.

http://www.mlive.com/weblogs/cutoffman/index.ssf?/mtlogs/mlive_cutoffman/archives/2006_10.html#198104</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Weather doesn&#8217;t look promising for tonight.  If the game is delayed until tomorrow night, I assume there would be no travel day and games 6 and 7 would be Saturday/Sunday?  In that case, Suppan wouldn&#8217;t be able to pitch twice in the series&#8211;only two days of rest between games 4 and 7.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.mlive.com/weblogs/cutoffman/index.ssf?/mtlogs/mlive_cutoffman/archives/2006_10.html#198104" rel="nofollow">http://www.mlive.com/weblogs/c.....tml#198104</a></p>
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		<title>By: Bobber</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22130</link>
		<dc:creator>Bobber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 12:29:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22130</guid>
		<description>Did I mention that those are complete games?

In fact every blessed game from here on in would be a complete game for Tiger pitching.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Did I mention that those are complete games?</p>
<p>In fact every blessed game from here on in would be a complete game for Tiger pitching.</p>
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		<title>By: Bobber</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22127</link>
		<dc:creator>Bobber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 12:15:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22127</guid>
		<description>&quot;So I guess that means we’re going to lose 10-1 tomorrow. Dang.&quot;

Yeah, but how about Verlander pitching (and winning) Thursday and again on Sunday?

That&#039;s something to look forward to!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;So I guess that means we’re going to lose 10-1 tomorrow. Dang.&#8221;</p>
<p>Yeah, but how about Verlander pitching (and winning) Thursday and again on Sunday?</p>
<p>That&#8217;s something to look forward to!</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22126</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 12:15:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22126</guid>
		<description>Charly, you must have had more coffee than I did this morning :).  I didn&#039;t expect to see such gleeful optimism this morning.  I would be happy if the Tigers put up 5 or 6 of your predicted 11 runs.

I know it is obvious, but last night watching the game I was SO bummed out about Granderson and Polanco&#039;s O-fers.  Right now you are practically guaranteed that 2 of the first 3 guys you send out to lead off the game are OUTS.  Hard to get the offense going with that.  

We might have only lost 5-0 last night, but it felt like we took more of a drubbing than that just because it was looking like we would have a hard time scoring 3 runs to win 3-2 and when the Cardinals increased the lead to 4-0 I said to myself that that was the ballgame.

I have not seen anything from our offense this series.  Are the Cardinals pitching &lt;b&gt;that&lt;/b&gt; well or did our bats go cold with the week of rest?  It&#039;s like we lost the fire we had.

I wouldn&#039;t mind the losing so much if we didn&#039;t look so pathetic swinging the bats.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Charly, you must have had more coffee than I did this morning <img src='http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> .  I didn&#8217;t expect to see such gleeful optimism this morning.  I would be happy if the Tigers put up 5 or 6 of your predicted 11 runs.</p>
<p>I know it is obvious, but last night watching the game I was SO bummed out about Granderson and Polanco&#8217;s O-fers.  Right now you are practically guaranteed that 2 of the first 3 guys you send out to lead off the game are OUTS.  Hard to get the offense going with that.  </p>
<p>We might have only lost 5-0 last night, but it felt like we took more of a drubbing than that just because it was looking like we would have a hard time scoring 3 runs to win 3-2 and when the Cardinals increased the lead to 4-0 I said to myself that that was the ballgame.</p>
<p>I have not seen anything from our offense this series.  Are the Cardinals pitching <b>that</b> well or did our bats go cold with the week of rest?  It&#8217;s like we lost the fire we had.</p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t mind the losing so much if we didn&#8217;t look so pathetic swinging the bats.</p>
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		<title>By: Charly Streetgang</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22098</link>
		<dc:creator>Charly Streetgang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 09:58:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22098</guid>
		<description>Maggs hit the ball hard. Casey&#039;s looking good. Monroe has already came through this series. Guillen too. Granderson needs to find his play off swing he had earlier and Pudge needs to step up. That being said, I predict a Tigers offensive explosion tonight. They are due for starting the game of with a 5 spot.

Game 3: Tigers 11 Cards 4

Dial it in folks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maggs hit the ball hard. Casey&#8217;s looking good. Monroe has already came through this series. Guillen too. Granderson needs to find his play off swing he had earlier and Pudge needs to step up. That being said, I predict a Tigers offensive explosion tonight. They are due for starting the game of with a 5 spot.</p>
<p>Game 3: Tigers 11 Cards 4</p>
<p>Dial it in folks.</p>
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		<title>By: Mack Avenue Tigers: A Detroit Tigers Blog &#187; World Series Game 3: For the Birds</title>
		<link>http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22070</link>
		<dc:creator>Mack Avenue Tigers: A Detroit Tigers Blog &#187; World Series Game 3: For the Birds</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Oct 2006 06:53:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.detroittigersweblog.com/2006/10/world-series-game-3-aftermath/#comment-22070</guid>
		<description>[...] Carpenter aside, St. Louis pitchers couldn&#8217;t hold the Tigers to the paltry number they have without some help. The batters just haven&#8217;t been patient. They&#8217;re not known for being patient, but they&#8217;ve been even worse than normal, as Bilfer points out. Today, the first six batters reached base approximately zero times, give or take zero. Curtis Granderson, Placido Polanco and Pudge Rodriguez are 0-for-the-World-Series. I just don&#8217;t mean hitless. They haven&#8217;t touched first base safely. Granderson and Pudge have both grounded into a double play, too. Magglio Ordonez at least has a number on the board: .200. Basically, if you&#8217;re looking for any good news at all, if you looked at those numbers and knew the Tigers played three games, you&#8217;d assume they were down, 0-3. But it&#8217;s only 1-2. Not the ideal position, But certainly not the end of the world. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Carpenter aside, St. Louis pitchers couldn&#8217;t hold the Tigers to the paltry number they have without some help. The batters just haven&#8217;t been patient. They&#8217;re not known for being patient, but they&#8217;ve been even worse than normal, as Bilfer points out. Today, the first six batters reached base approximately zero times, give or take zero. Curtis Granderson, Placido Polanco and Pudge Rodriguez are 0-for-the-World-Series. I just don&#8217;t mean hitless. They haven&#8217;t touched first base safely. Granderson and Pudge have both grounded into a double play, too. Magglio Ordonez at least has a number on the board: .200. Basically, if you&#8217;re looking for any good news at all, if you looked at those numbers and knew the Tigers played three games, you&#8217;d assume they were down, 0-3. But it&#8217;s only 1-2. Not the ideal position, But certainly not the end of the world. [...]</p>
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